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Monday
IM conversation
On Friday night (and into the wee hours of Sat. morn) friends gathered - new and old. Drinks were drunk, smokes were smoked, wounds were let to breathe, jokes were told, and good and rich and "kingdom-full" conversations pervaded the space. If the Kingdom were a party - this was surely a Kingdom gathering.
This AM John Barrow and I were IM'ing and he asked: (so here you go, enjoy. its only editted for flow and sensibility)
John: you guys talk about anything important?
Aaron: some - bean and alan and i talked for a couple hours (from 2-4 am) about Core stuff and VC direction. i'll try to summarize....
Aaron: basically their thought was that we should have (atleast) one more all VC gathering (like in June) to corporately discern what we are moving into. a leaders retreat will likely come out of that, but we need some sense of direction before we can do that. i think their thought with that was we don't really know what VC is anymore - it lacks significant identifiying structure and before we can add a new structure (i.e. Core conversation) we need to figure out where people are and such.... otherwise the thing we propose could be pointless. my hunch is that we'll end up continuing to articulate something of a Core of committed people - kinda of like a Religious Order - that will make public vows to God and the community and that that will be a new sense or layer of identity for VC.... but there needs to be some (as we've alreday begun talking about) public forum for that processing (with it being open-ended enough to say that if this ISN"T where God is leading then we lay it down). i kinda see it like we all need to lay all our cards on the table.... if people are clinging to a VC that no longer exists that should be stated, grieved, and moved on. if VC as an entity needs to die and be reborn as something different (non-vineyard, for instance) then fine. if there are folks who want/need/feel called to a Vineyard-ized Vineyard Central then perhaps they can have the "VC" name and hire a pastor and become a 'regular" church.... while others move into a network of house churches that share leadership and resources. or perhaps St. E's the building will become owned and operated by a Non-profit that will be a seperated (but related) entity than VC - so that VC can be the network of house churches that it needs to be
John: This sounds interesting. Will you bring up these ideas when we meet again as the pc?
Aaron: yeah - i'll probably post something of it too on the blog
Aaron: alan is online - i'll run what i told you by him to see if i missed anything
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Alan: cool - sounds about what we said - I was also stressing that the leadership who don't even want to be leadership, who've sort of drifted out during this period, ala - Brocks, Nixons, Barrs(?), etc. need to be there and at this LeTreat thing if not only for closure
Alan: it would be sad if relationships degraded to a point that people just slipped away from each other after all these years and ended up not talking and doing their own deals - I know sometimes that happens but in this case it definitely shouldn't I wouldn't think - again, I'm speaking as a friend and not an insider
Aaron: i agree - i think that that "slipping away-ness" would be a very bad thing in this time
Alan: it's sad to me already - as I look inside from what I've seen through 2-3 years
Aaron: yeah - i def. think there is (has been, and will be) some grieving going on, but on the whole i think we're continuing to move forward...
Alan: that's good - it's always hard to go through changes like this - evolution hurts
Aaron: truly, it does!
Aaron: maybe its even a bit of "changing of the guard" - with the desire for the "old guard" to not drift off, but to stay around as wisdom-bearers and sages
Alan: right
------------------------
John: BTW I think it is correct that everyone who has a stake in VC should have the chance to contribute to the conversation
Aaron: yeah, so do i... i've had some good conversations with elizabeth and charlie re: this stuff
John: I'm not one to cram things down other peoples throught. It feels to me like a bad leadership style. :-)
Aaron: agreed. so far i think we're far from doing that... i think we're doing well with moving forward and doing so TOGETHER
John: As has been the case with all these conversations I am looking forward to what will eventually come from it all.
Aaron: me too, me too!
--------------------------------
This AM John Barrow and I were IM'ing and he asked: (so here you go, enjoy. its only editted for flow and sensibility)
John: you guys talk about anything important?
Aaron: some - bean and alan and i talked for a couple hours (from 2-4 am) about Core stuff and VC direction. i'll try to summarize....
Aaron: basically their thought was that we should have (atleast) one more all VC gathering (like in June) to corporately discern what we are moving into. a leaders retreat will likely come out of that, but we need some sense of direction before we can do that. i think their thought with that was we don't really know what VC is anymore - it lacks significant identifiying structure and before we can add a new structure (i.e. Core conversation) we need to figure out where people are and such.... otherwise the thing we propose could be pointless. my hunch is that we'll end up continuing to articulate something of a Core of committed people - kinda of like a Religious Order - that will make public vows to God and the community and that that will be a new sense or layer of identity for VC.... but there needs to be some (as we've alreday begun talking about) public forum for that processing (with it being open-ended enough to say that if this ISN"T where God is leading then we lay it down). i kinda see it like we all need to lay all our cards on the table.... if people are clinging to a VC that no longer exists that should be stated, grieved, and moved on. if VC as an entity needs to die and be reborn as something different (non-vineyard, for instance) then fine. if there are folks who want/need/feel called to a Vineyard-ized Vineyard Central then perhaps they can have the "VC" name and hire a pastor and become a 'regular" church.... while others move into a network of house churches that share leadership and resources. or perhaps St. E's the building will become owned and operated by a Non-profit that will be a seperated (but related) entity than VC - so that VC can be the network of house churches that it needs to be
John: This sounds interesting. Will you bring up these ideas when we meet again as the pc?
Aaron: yeah - i'll probably post something of it too on the blog
Aaron: alan is online - i'll run what i told you by him to see if i missed anything
------------------------
Alan: cool - sounds about what we said - I was also stressing that the leadership who don't even want to be leadership, who've sort of drifted out during this period, ala - Brocks, Nixons, Barrs(?), etc. need to be there and at this LeTreat thing if not only for closure
Alan: it would be sad if relationships degraded to a point that people just slipped away from each other after all these years and ended up not talking and doing their own deals - I know sometimes that happens but in this case it definitely shouldn't I wouldn't think - again, I'm speaking as a friend and not an insider
Aaron: i agree - i think that that "slipping away-ness" would be a very bad thing in this time
Alan: it's sad to me already - as I look inside from what I've seen through 2-3 years
Aaron: yeah - i def. think there is (has been, and will be) some grieving going on, but on the whole i think we're continuing to move forward...
Alan: that's good - it's always hard to go through changes like this - evolution hurts
Aaron: truly, it does!
Aaron: maybe its even a bit of "changing of the guard" - with the desire for the "old guard" to not drift off, but to stay around as wisdom-bearers and sages
Alan: right
------------------------
John: BTW I think it is correct that everyone who has a stake in VC should have the chance to contribute to the conversation
Aaron: yeah, so do i... i've had some good conversations with elizabeth and charlie re: this stuff
John: I'm not one to cram things down other peoples throught. It feels to me like a bad leadership style. :-)
Aaron: agreed. so far i think we're far from doing that... i think we're doing well with moving forward and doing so TOGETHER
John: As has been the case with all these conversations I am looking forward to what will eventually come from it all.
Aaron: me too, me too!
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